You have been traveling a lot lately.
tailI've been asked that question a lot lately, and it's one of the things I'm struggling with (laughs). (Laughs.) I think the cool way to answer that question is to say that I travel a lot because I am a designer. Last year, or the year before, I changed my approach to making things by traveling, getting something from my travels, and then making something from that. Considering my background, this is the easiest way for me to do it, and it is something I feel only I can do. I think everyone goes to a big city like Paris to do research, but I don't think there are many people who go to a place that is not a tourist spot or something, a place where they don't know what it is, and get something out of it.
That may be true.
tailAs Mr. Kaneko mentioned earlier, you should go to local museums, look at ethnic costumes, etc., and get in touch with the way they are made and the materials they are made of. . This kind of approach is not only in foreign countries, but also in Japan. I felt the same way when I came into contact with the Ainu culture in Hokkaido a while ago. There are clothes that can only be made in a certain region. If it is a bit special, Kaneko-san finds it interesting and buys it, while I dig deeper to find out how it was born and how it is made. I interpret things like, "The windy climate of the area gave rise to the details that allow the front to be closed," and I apply them to my own clothes, even if they are not exactly as they are. This is a very difficult thing to do, but I go on trips in order to get that kind of feeling. I buy a lot of things when I am there because I have not gotten out of the habit of buying the actual thing (laughs).
You said yourself that you buy a tremendous amount of stuff every time you go on a business trip.
moneyI went to the market with Mr. Ozaki this time, and I thought, "This is a bit complicated. He buys a lot. That means there are a lot of things that he wants that I choose at the market (laughs). (Laughs.) This time, I found an old model of "Ventura" by "Hamilton,
tail. I buy it on the spot in one second (laughs).
money. my actions are being checked from afar (laughs).
tail. when I saw the bag in Kaneko-san's hand, I said, "Wow, that's bad. . There is a sense of frustration, isn't there? . There is a subtle victory or defeat in that kind of thing. I think people who buy vintage clothing understand this. It's like, "Oh, that guy put that out there. Why didn't he go that way? Whether or not you can find them is ultimately a matter of smell, and you feel like you're losing out.
money. sense of smell, that's super important.
tail. you know, where to go to find the best stuff. Of course there is luck, but I think it is the sense of smell that maximizes luck.
money. there is such a thing as a mystery, isn't there? But those who don't have it, don't have it.
tail. Well, I don't think it's necessarily necessary, since there are a few stores like Kaneko-san, where what you find at the market immediately becomes a business. . But, as Kaneko-san said earlier, having a sense of smell has a lot to do with what you do when you go to a joint exhibition.
money. yes, I think so.
tail. let's see if we can find that booth. But you have to be in the right place.
By the way, Kaneko-san, what is your impression of what Ozaki-san makes? It's about time to ask Mr. Kaneko a question (laughs).
money. yes, that's right (laughs).
tail.
moneyWell, it's not just Ozaki-kun, but there are three designers from "Edifice" with whom I still have a close relationship: Ozaki, Komori, and Itai (Shuji Itai, designer of "The FRANKLIN TAILORED").
Yes.
money. I know their tastes and interests quite well. . When I look at what they have created, I see that they have all created something that is uniquely their own.
tail: Indeed, Kaneko-san has known all of them for a long time.
money. Yes, I do. So I can really understand what they are making, like, "I get it. Moreover, it is wonderful that all three of them work well together without having their tastes clash. However, I personally don't buy their clothes. I only stock a few items from "Komori" now. I wonder why (laughs).
We talked about this in the first part of the interview, but we didn't get an answer (laughs).
moneyBut anyway, they are all outstanding in expressing their own personalities. They all have the ability to realize what they have drawn in their heads. Each of them has their own characteristics, but in Ozaki's case, he is the type of person who just pushes himself to the limit. He never neglects to dig down into something and give it shape.
tail. but I just don't do a very good job of communicating that to others.
moneyIs that so?
tail: Yes. I do a lot of things that are probably more geeky than people realize, but I feel that if I were to list them all and explain them, it would be too much work.
money. in that sense, as I said before, maybe I have a clumsy side to me. Basically, I think I am extremely dexterous.
tail. You may not know this, but I'm pretty clumsy. No, really .
Isn't that a kind of embarrassment? I'm kind of embarrassed to put it all out there.
tail. well, I don't know . Until Mr. Kaneko told me, I thought of myself as a dexterous person. But now that you mention it, I realize that I am indeed clumsy. It seems that I can do many things, but when I look at it from a bird's eye view, I realize that I can't do all of them. I am not able to convey what I want to say to others.
. There is a bit of a difference between wanting to convey a message but not getting it across and wanting to convey a message but not wanting it to get across that well.
tail. Yes, that's true. Moreover, even if I don't say too many words, the message is conveyed to those who get it. Then, I wonder whether I should go to such lengths to communicate with those who cannot understand unless I continue to put it into words. If I do so, I will eventually have to change what I make.
. - To make it easier to understand.
tail. Yes, I do. Not everything I make is based on this idea, but I don't think that I have to change what I make to make it appealing to a large number of people. I believe that there must be people who like the kind of clothes that Sankakke makes, and I throw a direct pitch to them. This was originally Kaneko-san's way of thinking.
long vowel mark (usually only used in katakana)Previous InterviewsYou also said that when I was allowed to do it.
tailI think that's right. It was during the time I was buying with Mr. Kaneko, and when I was at a bit of a standstill, he said to me, "Even if it's a difficult product, if you like it, you should do it. If you are one in a thousand or a thousand people, how many people have the same hobby as you, if there are a million of them? You can definitely sell to those 1,000 or 100 people, so don't make the mistake of getting that number wrong. I still keep that talk at the center of my craftsmanship. I am not trying to bend myself to make things, but I am thinking of ways to continue making things without bending myself.
I see.
tailThe "Sankakke" brand has changed its methods and products, and is about to do so again, but at its core, it is about passing on what I truly believe to be good to a few people. At the core, I want to convey what I really think is good to a few people, and I value increasing the number of such people by one or two each season. Many people have never seen our products, but when they do, they are almost always surprised and fall in love with them. I would like to increase the number of opportunities to show them our products in more places. Many of the products we made in the past can still be worn today, so I think we are still able to "come in without bending" at this point.
money: Maybe Sankakke could stop wholesaling.
tail: Hmmm . Yes, that's right. Of course, we are not going to suddenly stop completely, but I do think that we should try to sell in a more "B to C" way. From a buyer's point of view, it is difficult to buy "Sankakkei" because of the high risk involved. The way to avoid this risk is to create a situation where it is easy for the stores to sell the brand, but we have not been able to reach that level yet. In the end, I feel that sales promotion is not really my role.
money: Actually, I was having a conversation similar to that today. As for products that are difficult to sell in stores, I was wondering if maybe we should rethink the idea of having buyers look at them and buy them.
tail. is that what a buyer would say?
money. Rather than trying so hard to sell to buyers, I think we should be looking for ways to sell directly to customers. There is a brand of shoes called "Saba" that we sell at "reshop," which is a brand that does not originally sell wholesale. We call our showroom "Saba House," and customers call and make appointments to buy our products.
tail: Heh.
moneyI asked them to do wholesale business for me, and they did it for us! I asked them to do it for me, and they are doing it at my place. I also do pop-up stores for about three days at cool local hotels. They find a good space in each area and sell their products for a limited time while touring around the U.S.
tail. that's exactly what I meant earlier when I said I was going to change " Sankakke" again. I am thinking of focusing on direct sales at pop-ups and online sales. I think it will be difficult for people to understand the good aspects of the Sankakke brand unless I can create a system to communicate directly with customers.
money. yes, I think we should. I think you should.
tail. I used to be a buyer too, so I can see the numbers of how much I can buy in a season. . So I felt that I had to make some changes. . When I think about it, it is a bit similar to Itai's way of doing business. But he has his own store, so he is able to do things that way. Since I am a one-man business, it is impossible for me to own a store, so I am still searching for the best way to do things.
One of Mr. Ozaki's memories. Part 2
tailJohn Pearce: I've missed this one too, John Pearce.
money: Oh, I've missed it .
tailI was living in London, and I was put in charge of London. The work I did there was ordering for "John Pearce. This was also a symbolic item of "EDIFITH" at that time, wasn't it? John Pearce was a friend of Vivienne Westwood's, and he helped her make jackets, I think.
money. It cost about 29,000 yen, didn't it? . That was expensive at the time.
tail.: It's tailoring that has a punk mindset somewhere.
money: Yes, yes, yes.
tail. this is a recent purchase. If you ask me what originally made me fall in love with Kaneko-san and become his disciple, it was because the styling at Edifice, where there were brands like Jessica Ogden, which Kaneko-san mentioned in the first part, that I had never seen before, but mixed with something like Danton's work wear, was very shocking. It was very shocking.
-I see.
tail. and I don't wear these French work items, striped T-shirts, and items like "Repetto" now, but I still like them, and there's not a time when I don't have them. Also, it is interesting that you have come this far by mending torn pieces. That's not the way of thinking in American casual wear.
money. no. There is a culture of fixing and wearing. They don't buy new clothes.
tail. mainly in England and France, right? I think the culture in the U.S. is that it is faster to throw things away. Even jeans were thrown away. Even though the price goes up like that (laughs).
tail: Sorry for the continued espadrilles, but I bought these shockingly good espadrilles from "reshop". I haven't taken the black ones down yet, but I'm wearing the white ones like crazy.
money. I'm glad to hear that.
tailI really like espadrilles, and I had a fantasy that espadrilles were the way to go in the summer. I had a fantasy that espadrilles would be the footwear of choice at French resorts. I've been wearing a lot of different brands, but these really shocked me. I used to think that this kind of leather footwear was a bad idea, but these are out of the ordinary. What's great about them is that they're so soft on the toes.
money. yes. I still like it.
tail. it doesn't stretch too much. It's a masterpiece, this one .